Is the Dodge Challenger a Failure?
Ducati Minor
Pretty straight-forward question. Of the supposedly sold-out SRT-8s, hundreds remain seated in dealer showrooms. The SRT-8 did fall victim to poor timing (gas spikes and huge weight) and dealer add-on charges of up to $25K. Even though there has been some positive word on the lower-trim SE and R/T Challengers about to hit the market, the big flock to dealerships Dodge hoped for hasn't happened. Has the Challenger turned out to be another Chrysler dud? Has this attempt to evoke nostalgia for a "simpler time" ended up following the Plymouth Prowler and Chevy SSR as a failed experiment?
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BillS
I don't think the Challenger is as lame as the Prowler and SSR. For one thing, it has a manual tranny option. But maybe Chrysler and Chevy should learn from Ford on this one: stick with a brand, build the audience, be consistent.
JWBrothers
I don't know what the sales figures are or what the expectations were, but I wish the car was smaller and lighter. I guess I was expecting a svelte car with a big honkin' V8. It has the power, but it's a long way from svelte. Too sad.
Many Thanks
Jim
TheJackle
I just wish all of these mfg's would just realize that to sell these puppies to America, they need to remember that most of us are blue collar people and will not morgage the house just to buy one! Even though my family has been involved with auto racing most of my life and I'm an avid auto man, I just choose not to get so excited these day's about an auto that I like because to me they have all gotten so far out of range for an everyday Joe like me to buy that it just isn't in the forseeable future, unless they wisen up and get these prices back down to affordability, that I will give up on my 'Ol '88 vehicle that I own and can still work on, for something that is priced far too high over what it is actually worth just because there are still people who have unions running things and will never be paid enough for all of us working stiffs to be able to afford what they blindly build only to benefit their fat wallets, even though they know they aren't worth half of what they are priced to sell for! So for me to even think that I will ever own one of the "Mopar", "Rat's" or Ford's that are worth riding in ever again is just plain fantasy until the industry realizes that we are not stupid and will not sell the farm to own one, even though we would absolutely love to!
Mena
Dodge has sold 3990 Challengers year to date as of July. Not sure what their sales target is either. In comparison, Ford has sold 65,764 Mustangs over the same period. Not really fair since the Challenger wasn't on sale for most of the year but, IMO, I think they expected more than that.
JWBrothers
I was driving from southern Oklahoma to southern Indiana and stopped in St Louis, Mo for dinner. There was one in the parking lot that had the size of a '71 Monte Carlo or a '69 Grand Prix and the shape of a '72 Challenger. It's like they developed a personal luxury car and came out with the AMG version first. I don't understand the marketing strategy here. It's a good looking car and stupid fast. It aught to be selling out.
I've only seen this one since they came out. That can't be good.
Many Thanks
Jim
Anonymous
Let's call a spade a spade; the dealers got greedy with prices far north of MSRP; it's that simple. That hurt them in the long run because the folks who are patiently waiting for the manual trans Challenger to come out (like me!), will now shop elsewhere for this coveted classic.
I'll stick with my RAM SRT-1O with a 6 speed and 500 HP.....which I bought for less than sticker. Want to know the best part......they ONLY made 250 of them.....and I got one of them.
Good luck Dodge; you can thank the greedy dealers for this boondoggle.
Anonymous
Anonymous:
I absolutely agree with your comment about the "greedy" Chrysler dealers. Being a former '70 Cuda owner, I couldn't wait to get my hands on a new Challenger for $40K. For $60K, I'm not interested. And, I also would demand a manual trans.
Bruce
Anonymous
I can assure you they made more than 250 of those trucks. trust me i know
TheJackle
Yes they did...I'm with you because I worked for a Dodge dealer....that person was misinformed I think!
Mena
I've a seen a few around. All SRT8's but I did see a SE a couple of days ago.
Ducati Minor
I saw an SRT-8 here in the Saddleback Valley. It is a looker. With the low production numbers (even if Dodge can hit 20,000), the Challenger will be an interesting sight in the States.
Motive has a review of the SE and R/T models, and concluded the SE to be a great value (starting at $22K) and to be a big step over the primitive early '70s E-body Mopars, which were horribly built and poorly equipped below the mid-range V-8 trim.
The R/T rated like the Lancer Ralliart: a better value in numbers than the top-trim, offering the same looks for $10K less. The Dodge ain't an example of cutting-edge tech, but I like what I've read about the run-of-the-mill SE and the possibility of a fun aftermarket for the 3.5 L V-6.
Still, the news isn't sounding good for Dodge and its Challenger. Even the Camaro isn't fanning all that much excitement.
Bobby Mugabe
Well everyone thoght that to get that SRT-8 car one would have to get on a waiting list, but as it turned out, these cars did not sell.
To me the issue here is this, DEALERS. Look the cars had a lot of hype, dealers said to heck with MSRP, we will charge our own price. People came, saw, and refused to buy. Many still think that they will be unable to buy this car without getting ripped off.
What i suggest is that Chrysler crack down on any dealer who charges a costumer more than MSRP on any vehicle, not just Challenger. Because dealers play this game, consumer is left with a bad taste in the mouth and will never return to a dealer ship, to a brand that screwed him.
Dan Schoenecker
I think the answer is simple. Dodge dealers believed they could ratchet up the prices on a limited run of about 6600 SRT8's. Just this week I visited a Chrysler dealer in Milwaukee and the sticker still had a $20,000 mark up on it. My guess, at that price, it will continue to collect dust. A Challenger with $20K of mods will blow the doors off a SRT8. Hell, your pushing Corvette Z06 country for that kind of money. When the smaller engined units become avilable, I think we will see sales move up dramatically.
panteraman
It's the 70s dejavu.....Ford beat dodge n Chevy to the market with the Mustang...then insurance & gasoline costs put an end to all the fun for everyone. Fast fwd to now and even though I love the resurgence of muscle-cars I just don't see a huge audience at $5 per gallon! I think this car is gonna fall flat and the Camaro even "flatter".. Like anything, if you are going to be successful with a product you need to be the first guy out there. Retro is so retro now......
alex
Dealer greed is what is holding the sales back ...I would buy at chrysler list but not at 20k over ...remember in 2 years it will be just another used car ...
johann
dealer greed will always happen and i will not return to a dealer who tries to gouge you..if they blatenly get you at the sticker,how will they get you with stuff that isnt advertised..mopar should price the car in competetion with the mustang,not the corvette..what happened to the old bussiness idea of stock turnover...target the price to a younger group that can afford the car..not the group that has to convince the spouse that we need it...its a great lookin car !
Phil
It is unfortunate, the bad debut timing of this car. High gas prices, overwhelming size of the vehicle and the ever greedy dealerships. I cannot believe that in this economy with auto sales in the toilet, that dealerships would resort to gouging possible customers. I had such a bad experience at several dealerships in town ( St. Louis ) that I am not even going to consider this vehicle anymore. One dealer would not even open up the vehicle on the floor for me to look inside. I thought car companies were in business to sell cars. The mark-ups tanamount to legal extortion.
JB
I do not know how most people feel, however, when I see a side sticker with a price and with anything but reasonable information such as Wheels - $2,000 and such. I just walk away from the dealership, something like opening the door of a used car and finding it smells like a dog threw up.
Everyone needs to make a profit in order to stay in business. However, if they need to make $25,000 extra markup on a car, then they can do it without my business.
DJ
Question is... how big is the market for retro musclecars like this?
I'd question big numbers, especially since the Mustang appears to have cleaned up much of it.
Add to that sky-high fuel bills and you can see there's a big problem that's not going away soon.
Now if the Challenger -- which is a looker if not a must-have-it-now -- was an eco-friendly hybrid with telephone-number gas mileage, then that would be a USP that could have us all lining up for it.
Dealer markups don't help either, greedy half-wits.
Snake
I believe the end of 2009 will be the true test, when we see if they can move the non-SRT cars. But, the Camaro has IRS, and a 300hp V6.
Anonymous
I think the Challenger R/T is going to save this situation. Starting under $30K and available with the Viper 6-speed interests me and other enthusiasts. The little known fact is that a 6 speed manual tranny gives great gas mileage in highway driving. I have a friend with a Z06 Corvette who gets over 30 mpg. This and 375 horses compared to the SRT8's 425 make it a real bargain. I think my Dodge dealer will see me next spring when all this economic mess shakes out.
Anonymous
Definitely Dealer Greed first, fuel prices second. Everyone that I've spoken to that are in the market for a Challenger are waiting for the R/T models to come out which should erase the Dealer mark ups.
Denis
I have seen the SE and RT Challenger showing up on the street. The car is built at the same plant that builds the Chrysler 300 and the Dodge Charger, so there is room to shift production from one car to the next. Chrysler made the same mistake with the Pacifica bringing it out loaded ($36,000), and had to go back and make a lower priced base model. It is a good idea to have the STR, but maybe not as the first ones sold. This is a hot looking car that appeals to both men and women and should do good in the market next to the Mustang.
Jaybird
I wonder whether the car's slavish copying of the original design is hampering sales. Both the Mustang and Camaro are modern interpretations of their 60s counterparts. With the Challenger, it's hard to tell it's new without seeing one next to an original. Bigger, heavier, and way more expensive, even with inflation, don't help either.
I also think Chrysler has broken faith with Mopar devotees in selling out to a bunch of buyout manipulators with no real interest in building cars. Customers have to be asking, will the company still be around in couple of years?
c55mjm
Yes the Challenger has to fight high gas prices and greedy dealers. But the basic problem is size. The Challenger really is more like a two door Charger than a pony car. The recent new designs from the 'Big Three' are all over weight. The Ford Flex, the new GM crossover and the Challenger would be great cars if they were much lighter.
The Prowler had a V-6 and didn't sound like a hot rod. The SSR was an over weight pick up that couldn't tow or carry much. The Challenger is a small car that is too big.
AL P
I had a deposit garanteeing me the first one to hit Jordon Frasier Dodge in Bessemer Ala and they changed their name not owners BTW. I went in to check on the status of my new car and they said sorry too bad seeya...
Anonymous
The challenger is a great looking car! but no way will I ever pay sticker.Look at Carmax.com the CHARGER even though not the CHALLENGER- THE R/T is getting almost 10000k off sticker now. I will wait till the challenger has repeats plus the R/T manual requires premium gas- I don't think most people will buy with 4 dollars a gallon for the premium
Mena
If you can afford a Challenger V8, you can afford the extra $2 a week for premium gas. LOL!
Jeff near Brampton Plant
Apparently the brampton plant is cranking them out, but I really thought we'd see a bunch of them on the roads by now - since its supposed to be hot. I've seen one on the road - since launch, and a couple at some old car meets.. thats it. Makes you wonder.
Alan Canada
Could not agree more! I fell in love with this car as a 71 challenger owner and even stood on stage at Barett-Jackson as the number 1 production car was auctioned. I had a deposit on one of the first cars in Canada but my local dealership was not thought worthy enough to receive a first production car. Other dealers who got a car were asking stupid prices -- up to $30000 over MRSP.
I hope Dodge gets what it deserves for allowing price gouging by its favoured dealers.
I agree that the car is overweight and not what the customer really wants.
Good luck -- I love my '71 and have no intenion of parting with it --- but I went out and bought a Jaguar XF --same price as the idiots at Dodge were asking and a lot more quality!!!
Goodbye Dodge
GrandPrix08V8
Who knew they were available. I watch a fair amount of TV and I've never seen an ad for one. Dodge has my email address from the auto show but I've never received notice of the Challenger.
Omicron
Dealer greed is one thing, but $45000 for an american car is a tough pill to swallow when you can get a lot nicer car from Japan or Germany or even Korea for that kind of money. Add greedy dealer markups on top of that and the price slips into the absurd range.
IMHO, if base V6 Challenger were $15-20K, the R/T $20-25K, and the SRT8 $25-35K then Chrysler wouldn't be able to keep them on the lots.
Remember the original muscle car creedo: light weight (ok, we'll let this one go), cheap car, big power
omicron
Omnicron, i agree.
I'm a huge Chrysler guy, i've wanted an ebody since i was 10. I'm now 30, and have never been able to get one.
When the challenger was announced, I was ecstatic at the thought I could finally afford one.
I went to the dealership when they hit the lots, and almost had my eyes gouged out with their greed, they managed to raise a plain SE to $34,000 with various fees, and market adjustments. So I left and never bought one. Plus, I've always wanted a hemi, and it's about 5 grand above what I could afford.
And I just can't get myself to buy a V6. For 26 grand for an RT, they coudnt get me to sign fast enough.
Mena
Wait a year or two then get a used low mileage SRT8. It'll probably be under $30k by then.
Yellow Harley
I purchased a White 2009 six speed Challenger R/T almost two months ago. I'm 58 years old and have owned around forty cars and trucks in my life. Let me tell you, I have never had a car that gets so much attention, has people asking me about and taking pictures of it every time I stop, and has just really been great fun to drive. I think sales have gone good, It's been good enough that Chrysler hasn't felt the need to advertise the Challenger yet. I paid $1000.00 less than MSRP and after owning and driving this car, knowing what I know now, I would have paid a lot more.
BillS
Good car, bad price.
twopikes@mts.net
I hope they stand behind this vehicle should it have teething problems.
peopleeater
I had a 2001 PT Cruiser, that I Loved driving. It was my first car, and I had never had any problems with it.
When the Challenger came out, I really considered getting one. My car was getting old (about 8 years at that time about 80,000 miles) and I wanted to get a new car, and the Challenger was really appealing. My mother was buying a new Dodge Caravan (she's owend about 6 of them since 84') and I asked someone at the dealership about the Challenger "$20,000 OVER INVOICE" he yelled at me..literally, I didn't even ask for a brosure.
That was when the 08's came out. Now, I went looking again, and found a dealership with, Dare I say, someone honest. I ordered a 2010 Challenger R/T classic in plum crazy purple with white stripes. I hope get it before January. I got it for $1000 under MSRP. I can't wait to get it, just to drive it.
The funny thing is, the few people I've talked to about getting this car ask "Isn't that car like $50,000" I actually had a print out from the dealership with a quote, and had to show it to the guy that it wasn't nearly that expensive.
I know with the things the way they are, people who "need" a new car aren't going to be buying an expensive car, but just something that will be reliable for them. I went for something a bit more flashy.